Posted by Frederick J. Young on June 08, 2003 at 07:52:39:
In Reply to: Re: Re: What do you consider "good intonation?" posted by Masterblaster on June 07, 2003 at 11:22:23:
The horn and bassoon get into the last octave or so of the piano keyboard, The lowest note on the bassoon is Bb at 58.27 hertz and the horn sometimes descends in quintets to a low F or E below that at a frequency of 41.2 hertz for the E (concert pitch). Thus, much of the tuba range is covered in the woodwind quintet. In particular, the horn and bassoon often play in fifths, octaves and tenths. In the case of these intervals poor intonation as evidenced by beats is clear. I think the most disturbing beats are the slow ones.
It is interesting that you mention 20 cents as being acceptable because pianos are tuned as much as 25 cents flat in the bottom octave and are correspondingly high in the top octaves. One can have real trouble from the piano after it play a low C just before the tuba enters the cadenza in the R V Williams Concerto first movement. One needs to pull his tuning slide out before playing that C or he/she will be accused of being sharp!
I think tubists routinely get away with being out of tune by 20 cents. However, many of the notes in the last octave of the piano tend to be much more out of tune and their harmonics cause trouble to many of the higher instrumentalists. Imagine the flute or oboe tone that goes wa wa wa wa because the largest harmonic of a tuba playing three octaves lower beats with the flute or oboe tone. Those players (luckily) are unaware of the cause.
In tuba euph ensembles, tubists frequently have trouble playing inner parts because their ears tell them to play in tune and their instruments play too far out of tune.
Your logic seems reasonable, but why not opt for better in tune tubas when they have been available for the last 120 years?